SF #8 Mustang Rare???

[motorman]

This listing has now ended. I didnt bid.
What do you think about this one???

http://m.ebay.co.uk/itm/191429823095?nav=WATCHING_ENDED

[Idris]

Rare/unconfirmed variation + unzoomable photographs + odd looking baseplate rivet + as-good-as no buying feedback (implying a second Ebay account) = leave well alone!

[SMS88]

Looks like a resprayed example - rivit looks like baseplate has been off and front edge of bonnet has scar in metal under paint that makes me think its a repaint using non oven baked paint

[numi]

This White Mustang specimen reminds me of the #33 White interior Miura with tow-guide and suspicious base rivets.Then again coming from Brennan,these odd-types are possible.
numi

[kwakers]

As Numi just hinted, this Mustang was for REAL and genuine in my book. I had added rwctoys his other account to our VBD honest Sellers list back at it's inception after Befora fell. The Seller that has this second account is in fact Bob Brennen, who I have always known to be one of the most serious and honest Matchbox collector these past 45 years. Bob is a bit rough, all business, and not very communicative, but always honest. Ask George about Bob's communications, they are terse on his best days now. 'Do not bid if you are in doubt'. He means it! His non blow up pictures are signs of a fellow 'caveman' in electronic pictures, and many of his mint model listings on both accounts are sold VERY underdescribed with only 2 vague pictures. Numi mentioned both of his accounts here once before for those of us with short memories (when that green two line Pickfords was questioned by SCM?), so now we can all take written notes.....LOL
I had been collecting for 5 years when Bob was quite new to the hobby in 1969, but his NAMC Club and Guides are now famous for U.S. store bought variations we shared with each other that Mike Stannard never even cared to ask U.S. collectors about when drafting his U.K. Guide in 1985. I am sure the rivet is original as well as the model's paint and interior, and he will gladly return any model that is not satisfactory. I am unaware of any problems ever with Bob, and most of the rarest Lesney variations have probably come out of his collection or spares over his long collecting career. kwakers

[SMS88]

As Numi just hinted, this Mustang was for REAL and genuine in my book. I had added rwctoys his other account to our VBD honest Sellers list back at it's inception after Befora fell. The Seller that has this second account is in fact Bob Brennen, who I have always known to be one of the most serious and honest Matchbox collector these past 45 years. Bob is a bit rough, all business, and not very communicative, but always honest. Ask George about Bob's communications, they are terse on his best days now. 'Do not bid if you are in doubt'. He means it! His non blow up pictures are signs of a fellow 'caveman' in electronic pictures, and many of his mint model listings on both accounts are sold VERY underdescribed with only 2 vague pictures. Numi mentioned both of his accounts here once before for those of us with short memories (when that green two line Pickfords was questioned by SCM?), so now we can all take written notes.....LOL
I had been collecting for 5 years when Bob was quite new to the hobby in 1969, but his NAMC Club and Guides are now famous for U.S. store bought variations we shared with each other that Mike Stannard never even cared to ask U.S. collectors about when drafting his U.K. Guide in 1985. I am sure the rivet is original as well as the model's paint and interior, and he will gladly return any model that is not satisfactory. I am unaware of any problems ever with Bob, and most of the rarest Lesney variations have probably come out of his collection or spares over his long collecting career. kwakers

I am sure the rivit is original too however the Lesney design makes this the easiest 1-75 second only to most early 45a when it comes to having baseplates that just pop off and back on again leaving hardly a trace for a simple seat swap which could have been done easily anytime before bob bought it. The chipping pattern is unusual for oven baked paint but typical of hobby spray

[GHOSTHUNTER]

Rare/unconfirmed variation + unzoomable photographs + odd looking baseplate rivet + as-good-as no buying feedback (implying a second Ebay account) = leave well alone!

Hugh, if you scroll down the e-page, there are larger images, as shown below.



Ghosty.

[Idris]

Hugh, if you scroll down the e-page, there are larger images, as shown below.

So there are!
The rivet in that shot looks as though it could pass muster.

[motorman]

As Numi just hinted, this Mustang was for REAL and genuine in my book. I had added rwctoys his other account to our VBD honest Sellers list back at it's inception after Befora fell. The Seller that has this second account is in fact Bob Brennen, who I have always known to be one of the most serious and honest Matchbox collector these past 45 years. Bob is a bit rough, all business, and not very communicative, but always honest. Ask George about Bob's communications, they are terse on his best days now. 'Do not bid if you are in doubt'. He means it! His non blow up pictures are signs of a fellow 'caveman' in electronic pictures, and many of his mint model listings on both accounts are sold VERY underdescribed with only 2 vague pictures. Numi mentioned both of his accounts here once before for those of us with short memories (when that green two line Pickfords was questioned by SCM?), so now we can all take written notes.....LOL
I had been collecting for 5 years when Bob was quite new to the hobby in 1969, but his NAMC Club and Guides are now famous for U.S. store bought variations we shared with each other that Mike Stannard never even cared to ask U.S. collectors about when drafting his U.K. Guide in 1985. I am sure the rivet is original as well as the model's paint and interior, and he will gladly return any model that is not satisfactory. I am unaware of any problems ever with Bob, and most of the rarest Lesney variations have probably come out of his collection or spares over his long collecting career. kwakers

Dick, I have bought from this seller before without any issues and am not in any doubt about the integrity of the seller, far from it.

What did catch my eye was that this is a variation of the SF#8 Mustang that i have never seen before.

Very few of these White SF#8 Mustangs have been seen over the years with the white interior, the last one that i can recall seeing was the example Rob sold at Vectis a couple of years ago.

All references to this variation state that they were pre pro/sales samples and were produced with thin wheels and not the wider 4mm low friction wheel seen in this example. I have never seen this variation with the wider 4mm wheel.

Now i am going to sound like an old record as I have said this before regarding other models i have commented on, but when you see a variation with extensive body work paint damage as this one has, I would expect the base plate to reflect some of this damage and at the very least the wheels should have evidence of wear and yet the baseplate and wheels are dare i say it...... mint!

I also think it is odd that considering the vast knowledge the seller has on the subject of matchbox that he would not make a huge song and dance about this "never seen before" variation, which i would expect to see if the seller was confident that it was authentic.

Mick commented on the ease of removing the baseplate from this variation without damaging the rivit. This MUST be considered as a very likely possibility with this particular listing IMHO. Certainly one that cannot just be ignored.

This listing did not make big money for the seller, mainly because lots of potential bidders had concerns regards its authenticity IMHO, (i feel the seller may also have had his own concerns going by the lacklustre description added to the listing).

Given that Rob's example made £2000 plus commission, the seller of this latest example will be doing one of two things, either crying his eyes out that it did not make 4 figures or jumping for joy that he managed to make as much as he did.

I think the latter!!

[kwakers]

Motorman, you have done just what Bob says in ALL his listings: "not sure, do not order, always the safest bet" If the Mustang sold was not for you, so be it.
I have known Bob on a collecting level since 1969, 45 years now. Bob is 80+ years old, and has forgotten more about Lesneys than I have known in all my 50 years of collecting. He currently has 300+ models listed each and every week, cries over nothing, and celebrates nothing as he sells off thousands of his long held toys. He simply has lived and collected Genuine Toys all his life. My opinion is that this Toy is as genuine as Bob, and with the collectors like you and I that he is selling to, there is no need for him to chuff up his listings as you may be suggesting. You have heard everyone here stating that a used rare is bought at 10-15% of it's Mint value, so no surprise here at all, just a normal market price for that rare of a Superfast in lightly playworn condition.
On that note, the white paint on this model has several scars that have not been 'touched up', so I cannot say it is half as 'played with' as you seem to grade it as Motorman. I wish some of my rares could still be found this nice today. Playing on rugs and raceways did not damage these Superfast wheels, but collisions and throwing the toys all in a box at the end of each play day tend to cause body damage far worse than this model exhibits.
Motorman, Bob Brennen has brought us unheard of variations like the #20 RW Taxi without front tow guide, the 33 Lambo variations WITH Tow guides, full white and also some odd color interiors in early regular wheels, and many more unheard of variations like them he has now sold off. He not only found and collected them with some being almost unique, but has lots of spares left that will continue to surprise the 'Best' of us. kwakers