Hi all,
Just a few of the bullet points to clear up some of the myths I've heard over the years about these models, and to try to make it easier to distinguish between them. By no means a post for the experts, but something to help anyone wanting to get a start in these wonderful, and frustrating, models.
Couple of dates to start, Meccano issued a sales letter to dealers for Xmas 1939 stating that Dinky Toys were among the limited range they were selling that year, it is safe to assume that by the early months of 1940 production had ceased. Dinkys were not back in the shops until Xmas 1945.
1. Only Pre War models are made of lead.
True. Lead was dropped very early in the Dinky range, typically the 22 Series and 28/1 vans were lead, suffer no fatigue, and are quite heavy in the hand.
I wish I could show you some but sadly they remain well beyond my budget at over £1000.00 for a good one.
What I can show are a few easy to spot Pre Wars as these are castings not made after the war....
22 Series Open Coupe and 28/2 Ford Van.
24 Series Town Sedan.
34 Series Morris Airmail Van
25 Series Type 1 with tinplate radiator, no headlights and bonnet retaining slot, all of these features are pre war only.
2. Only Pre War models suffer fatigue.
True in part, whilst it is true that the versions of pre war models made after the war do not have the problem, Dinky suffered from poor metal issues into the '50's,
the large trailer and Type 1 Foden flatbeds are known to suffer......
Here the bed is clearly bending up from the chassis,
and in the case of the chain lorry has sadly cracked right across.
3. Pre War models are bigger than Post war.
Not True. The same dies were used after the war, it's easy to see how this came about though, as the fatigue causes the models to literally stretch to bursting point..
Pre War 23 Series on left, noticeably smaller Post War on right.
Though these Pre and Post War 23's are the same size, showing very little fatigue in the early model.
Even more noticeable on the Pre War 28/3 in the centre, Post War's to each side.
4. Pre War models have cast open windows, Post War are closed.
Not True. Open windows were closed off over a period of time as dies wore, not just at the start of Post War production.
Red Post War 30 Series has the rear window still cast open.
Likewise on this post War 30 as well.
5. Pre War models have smooth hubs, Post War are ridged.
Not true, the first Post War models till about 1946 still used smooth hubs.
Both these 25 Series are Post War, smooth hubs on left, ridged on right.
Likewise white tyres are no indicator of Pre War, although not made Post War, they are so easily swopped, and re-pro's have been made for so many years now that they cannot be used to indicate anything.
6. Pre War models have thin axles, Post War axles are thicker.
True. This is what you should really look for in a Pre War model.
Top pic : Pre war on left, Post war on right, bottom pic other way round, easier to see in the hand thankfully.
7. Open Chassis's are Pre War, Closed Chassis's are Post War.
Again, yes, and no. Some open chassis's like the 24 Series X chassis on the left were Pre War only, the detailed 36 Series chassis on the right is Post War.......
In other cases like the 25 Series, the Type 2 Pre War chassis was used again till about 1946.
Pre War at bottom, Post War at top.
Pre - Post War Type 2 chassis, and Post War only type 3.
Sure sign of a very early Post War chassis is if it has surplus Hornby Train tinplate cut up for a Dinky chassis, tin was short in 1945!
8. Only Pre War Commercials had advertising.
Not true. Although the 28 Series Vans, and 33 Series Mech Horses lost adverts after the war, the 25 Series kept them for a few months at least.
Pre War type smooth wheels, white tyres, Wakefield Castrol Oil livery, and POST war axles.
That's it Gents, let me know if you find it useful, or want pix of anything in detail?
Cheers
Chris Warr.
Pre War V Post war Dinky Toys.
Re: Pre War V Post war Dinky Toys.
Chris, it reads like an absolute minefield! Thank you very much for sharing your knowledge with the Forum, I for one appreciate it and at least I now have some idea of what I should be looking for when scouring junk and antique shops!
I must say that I find beginners' guides like this absolutely fascinating, and I wish we could have more of them so that those of us who wear Lesney blinkers could have our eyes opened regarding what we should be looking out for when it comes to other makes.
I must say that I find beginners' guides like this absolutely fascinating, and I wish we could have more of them so that those of us who wear Lesney blinkers could have our eyes opened regarding what we should be looking out for when it comes to other makes.
Re: Pre War V Post war Dinky Toys.
Chris,
Thank you very much for such an interesting post and some fascinating images aswell.
What is very noticable is that many of the models you have shown have clear signs of metal fatigue.
If i was to start collecting post war Dinky models, fatigue is obviously a factor to consider but should it be feared?
If i consider buying a model with early signs of metal fatigue (like some of the images you have posted) should i walk away from it in fear of it disintegrating over a short period of time or is there a way to ensure that you can prevent the metal fatigue getting worse and therefore buy with some confidence?
Fatigue or not i love this snippet of your collection, thanks for showing.
Thank you very much for such an interesting post and some fascinating images aswell.
What is very noticable is that many of the models you have shown have clear signs of metal fatigue.
If i was to start collecting post war Dinky models, fatigue is obviously a factor to consider but should it be feared?
If i consider buying a model with early signs of metal fatigue (like some of the images you have posted) should i walk away from it in fear of it disintegrating over a short period of time or is there a way to ensure that you can prevent the metal fatigue getting worse and therefore buy with some confidence?
Fatigue or not i love this snippet of your collection, thanks for showing.
MOTORMAN
"Kill all my demons and my angels will die too"
"Kill all my demons and my angels will die too"
Re: Pre War V Post war Dinky Toys.
Thanks both!
Fatigue isn't anything to worry about on Post Wars, it only shows up on a few models, and unless they are particularly HTF like the Mk1 Foden Chain lorry, generally you can just wait for a better one to come along.
If you collect Pre War fatigue is a fact of life, I don't let it bother me, I bought my first Pre War the 28/2 Ford Crawfords van 20 years ago, and it's still no worse now than then. I've only ever had one tragedy when my 25a Type 1 lorry got tapped by a sliding cabinet door and shattered, literally burst! Tweezers, superglue and a magnifying glass and it's pretty much back together.
CW.
Fatigue isn't anything to worry about on Post Wars, it only shows up on a few models, and unless they are particularly HTF like the Mk1 Foden Chain lorry, generally you can just wait for a better one to come along.
If you collect Pre War fatigue is a fact of life, I don't let it bother me, I bought my first Pre War the 28/2 Ford Crawfords van 20 years ago, and it's still no worse now than then. I've only ever had one tragedy when my 25a Type 1 lorry got tapped by a sliding cabinet door and shattered, literally burst! Tweezers, superglue and a magnifying glass and it's pretty much back together.
CW.
Re: Pre War V Post war Dinky Toys.
Thanks Chris, It is certainly an area of collecting that i have little experience of. Despite that it does interest me greatly and it is only a matter of time before i buy some Dinky Fodens which i seem to be drawn to for some reason. I never got a Dinky foden as a kid but a wish i did as they are superb toys and great display pieces. Thanks again
MOTORMAN
"Kill all my demons and my angels will die too"
"Kill all my demons and my angels will die too"
Re: Pre War V Post war Dinky Toys.
What a beautiful collection!
Cam
Cam
If it wasn't for drugs, alcohol, and stupidity, I'd be out of work!
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Re: Pre War V Post war Dinky Toys.
It is interesting that many model collectors actually started their collecting bug on Dinky Toy products, progressing onto the Corgies and Matchboxes of this world.
I now see that some of our esteemed forum members, are considering adding Dinky Toys to their collecting 'CV', this is good news for the forum in general and good news for the hobby.
It will add another string to their bows and give them some extra experience to pass on to other forum members, as they may just have the right Dinkies to talk about.
The forum benefits by carrying more and more model car information, available to new members and by the power of 'word of mouth' (mostly replaced these days by search engines), the forum will reach out to even more new members when 'Google' etc, crawl all over the pages, looking for something to fill up their search results pages.
Good luck to those members who have, or are just starting their Dinky collecting journey, you will enjoy it all the way, as starni999 has shown above, there are lots of variations and details to look out for.
GHOSTHUNTER.
I now see that some of our esteemed forum members, are considering adding Dinky Toys to their collecting 'CV', this is good news for the forum in general and good news for the hobby.
It will add another string to their bows and give them some extra experience to pass on to other forum members, as they may just have the right Dinkies to talk about.
The forum benefits by carrying more and more model car information, available to new members and by the power of 'word of mouth' (mostly replaced these days by search engines), the forum will reach out to even more new members when 'Google' etc, crawl all over the pages, looking for something to fill up their search results pages.
Good luck to those members who have, or are just starting their Dinky collecting journey, you will enjoy it all the way, as starni999 has shown above, there are lots of variations and details to look out for.
GHOSTHUNTER.
Re: Pre War V Post war Dinky Toys.
Great information, as well as the great pictures. Thanks for posting.
Bob
Bob
Re: Pre War V Post war Dinky Toys.
Thanks for posting Chris, I really enjoy seeing your pre and early post war models. Here in New Zealand they just are not available other than at stratospheric prices on the bay. The time and effort you put into acquiring these has really paid off.
Cheers
Dave
Cheers
Dave
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Re: Pre War V Post war Dinky Toys.
I was at the Brentwood toyfair yesterday. There were all the usual playworn Dinkys but several of the dealers also had quite a few that had been repainted and I'm pretty sure they all came from the same collection as the commercials were all painted yellow, The cars were all different colours. But looking at some of them I did notice the underneath of the bumpers and running boards were not painted properly and the original paint could be seen and there was little evidence of any playwear, These were all models from the 40's and 50's and I'm sure some of them could be recovered by removing the overpainting by a soaking them in brake fluid, The cars were all priced at under £10 each so if you live in the Brentwood area it just might be worth your while going to the next Brentwood fair and checking them out.
Nick Jones.
In sunny Clacton-on-Sea, Essex, UK
In sunny Clacton-on-Sea, Essex, UK