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yellowfoden wrote:Glenn, could I ask a favour and get you to measure the rear ejector ring diameter on your model without rear brace please

My pleasure. Working from front to back, they're 5.4, 4.2 and 5.4 mm. The two largest are difficult to measure on this particular 30c - the front is very slightly raised, while the rear is slightly indented. The rear ejector ring is larger on my later 30cs - 6.0 mm (no tow guide, orange rivet) and 6.7 mm (tow guide, unpainted rivet).

Pierkemimi wrote:Mine two models without rear brace have also the thinner wheels same as my turqouise models.

Thanks. It feels like there's some logic to the wheel widths, with only the later models having the wide wheels.

Glenn

yellowfoden wrote:The closer you look at this model the more detail there is

Too true - here's another casting difference. My early 30c (without rear brace) has flared wheel arches (almost like mudflaps), and the metal on the flared part of the wheel arches is thinner. They're the same on the three rear-most arches on both sides, but I've only shown the two central ones here. Let me know if these pictures aren't clear enough and I'll have another go.

Is this on all the braceless 30cs or only the earliest?

Glenn

Have got a normal model with thin wheels, with a red hook, no tow guide with thick lower brace. Will look furhter for more models in my collection to see if there are more.

Here's my first go at a variation list for the 30c. I've made quite a few assumptions in putting this together, so it's certainly not right. I hope it will encourage people to confirm or deny the existence of some variations.

1 I've assumed that there are two versions without the rear brace: the one I've pictured with flared wheel arches, and a later version with straight wheel arches. I've done this because I think that I've seen pictures of braceless cranes with straight wheels arches - for example, Dan's here. But this could be wrong - perhaps the flared wheel arches persisted until the after the brace was added? My flared arch model came with several Superfast prepros, so it's possible it's also a prepro.

2 I've assumed the turquoise version has the thick cab / small brace. I've no idea really, and I've found no pictures to help, but this seems more likely because I presume the cab wall must have been reinforced fairly early (though I wonder why).

3 I've left the two versions with red hooks in, as in Nick's guide, and assumed the first has thin wheels. I'm sure that there are other variations with red and grey hooks, but they're easy to swap.

4 I've added the thin/thick wheels variant, which seems to appear without the tow guide. This means that all tow guide models have thick wheels (is this correct?). I've added a code for Sebastian's mixed wheel models, because these help to put this change in order.

5 As mentioned above, I've assumed that all tow guide models have thick wheels. This could be wrong.

Bert (Yellowfoden) asked about ejector ring sizes, and Antonin (Diecast) has shown different shades of green and orange, as well as changes to the inside of the base. I've left these out for now because I just don't know enough to put them in. Antonin also gives slightly different widths for the wheels, but the thicker wheels have a distinctively flat profile to their treads and are easy to spot.

Anyway, over to you - what's wrong, what else do you have?

Glenn

change n°5 turqouise : cab wall thin, large brace.(3 times the same)
I can confirm n° 2 (have the model twice),also n° 6, 10.
The rest is for tomorrow.

Can I suggest Glenn now adds the ''Pierkemimi'' additions to his code list without deleting his first attempt. This gives us Two versions of Glenn's #30c code listing. If more varitions or reposoitions come forward, a new listing can be done and by doing all this we will come pretty close to a definitive model build listing which in turn will be a close Lesney issuing listing.

The more we can do this the less variations can exist because we will have recorded them and it is just the case of getting them in the right build order.

I must just add that during compiling listings such as this, you must be aware of 'Old Stock' components being put back onto the flow line for full production and this will cause a problem when trying to work out the 'Time-Line' which applies to all the Lesney produced ranges.

Ghosthunter.

Pierkemimi wrote:change n°5 turqouise : cab wall thin, large brace.(3 times the same)
I can confirm n° 2 (have the model twice),also n° 6, 10.
The rest is for tomorrow.

Thanks!

GHOSTHUNTER wrote:Can I suggest Glenn now adds the ''Pierkemimi'' additions to his code list without deleting his first attempt. This gives us Two versions of Glenn's #30c code listing. If more varitions or reposoitions come forward, a new listing can be done and by doing all this we will come pretty close to a definitive model build listing which in turn will be a close Lesney issuing listing.

I've added Pierkemimi's turquoise 30c in the right place, but without a variation code for now. I've greyed out my original guess for turquoise because I expect it doesn't exist, but left it in place. I've also added a column to list who's verified each variation. I've left the new codes the same so that the thread continues to make sense.

GHOSTHUNTER wrote:...you must be aware of 'Old Stock' components being put back onto the flow line for full production

It will be interesting to see what emerges - I hope someone has a thin cab with a tow guide!

Thank's Glenn that works well, it shows models placed in your inital position, then new additions slotting-in helping to complete the jigsaw.

This process could be applied to more models if members are able to do similar lists based on the models they own. Antonin (''diecast'') is also doing sterling work with his code listings.

Ghosthunter.

N° 8 also in my collection. Kurt

DrJeep wrote:.......Anyway, over to you - what's wrong, what else do you have? Glenn

Hi Glenn,

Thanks for checking the sizes of the ejector rings, that is going to be work in progress as I don’t have a big enough sample to see a pattern yet.

As the saying goes “just when you thought it was safe to go back in the water”….
We have variations of the base plate apart from the no tow guide and with tow guide.
Base plates can come with two small plates or pips each side near axle supports that keep the axle away from the flat surface.
It can also come with a raised plate or cross member that goes full width.
It only applies to front axle.

I have the following combination base plates and I have added another column in my own table and added where they fit onto your codes.

Two plates, without tow guide, orange painted jib rivet, thin cab wall – large brace..... Glenn code 3


Full width plate, without tow guide, unpainted jib rivet, thick cab wall – small brace..... Glenn code 7


Full width plate, with tow guide, unpainted jib rivet, thick cab wall – small brace..... Glenn code 10


I expect we could find the two plate version on unpainted jib rivet variation and others.

Glenn, what type base plate with reference to axle plate is on your code 4 please and if Kay reads this what type front axle setup is on his.

Photos attached of my three types.

Bert