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Tinman wrote:Although Nick lists, as Code 2, a model with thin boom, yellow cab, green bed and gray hook ... I've never heard of anyone that owns this model, never seen a photo of this model and wonder if it really exists. If it does exist, it would be the most rare of all 13d models.

We discussed this on Lefora and came to the conclusion that the variation is (as far as we know) known solely from the box art. However, since Mick has previously shown us a standard colour Wrecker with a factory-repainted cab casting, it seems plausible that the code 2 does exist, either using repainted or left over castings from the initial reverse coloured run.

A black and white advertising photo either by Lesney UK or Bronner showing a thin boomed standard coloured wrecker with typical messy mask sprayed silver trim came up for discussion when I was new to forums, 2005-2007 , almost 90% sure it was mcch ,10% chance it was Hobby talk . Nobody had seen the model in the metal but the official photo which was part of a trade catalog or hobby magazine was clearly real.
The discussion moved onto to whether or not mask sprayed trim was ever factory applied to standard coloured wreckers and the theory was proposed that all mask sprayed trim wreckers were made at the same time as a colour trial for BP to choose - box art showed Lesney favoured green cabs but as we all know BP favoured yellow cabs.Its a reasonable theory because why should a new wrecker that may or may not get sponsered not be colour trialed like everything else, especially when we know non corporate yellow was used on the reverse wreckers which have survived but corporate yellow was already in the paint shop used on the existing #25b.
BTW the factory repainted example I have only has a yellow chassis that has been overpainted green, cab is standard but early with low ejector ring mark

Checklist for genuine 1964 factory reverse wrecker:
1. thin booms
2. flat or indented ejector ring
3. glossy yellow chassis not BP corporate but halfway between it and Muira yellow
4. smooth thinner base without thin step between back axle and central rivit
5. off white background to dull BP decals
6. ALL tyres carry faint imprint ´´Lesney´´ and ´´England´´ on both sides
7. grey hook
8. mask sprayed silver trim usually with overspray around headlamps,grille and numberplates

SMS88 wrote:Checklist for genuine 1964 factory reverse wrecker:
1. thin booms
2. flat or indented ejector ring
3. glossy yellow chassis not BP corporate but halfway between it and Muira yellow
4. smooth thinner base without thin step between back axle and central rivit
5. off white background to dull BP decals
6. ALL tyres carry faint imprint ´´Lesney´´ and ´´England´´ on both sides
7. grey hook
8. mask sprayed silver trim usually with overspray around headlamps,grille and numberplates

Thanks Mick, that's exactly the type of information that i am looking for.

Why Al have you found one for a £1

fixer wrote:Why Al have you found one for a £1

Maybees aye maybees naw?.........................naw!!!

Mike Stannard states in his guide that the early issue reverse wreckers all had the thin boom and goes on to state

"These earlier castings of the model with green cabs are thought to have been trial runs"

Now that statement tells me that if these were colour trials then they must have been produced with the approval of Lesney management at least to trial stage.

I assume that this particular variation would have been of great interest to Mike Stannard and that he would have gone out of his way to get as much information on its origins as he could for his guide. With that in mind i will also assume that he spoke to a few knowledgable collectors or possibly ex lesney employees at the time of his conducting his research and that would have been were this information about them being trials came from.

He also states

"In 1970 models with green cabs were produced, unknown to Lesney, in their factory and sold to collectors as authentic"

This has confused me as (unless i am mistaken) i have a recollection of a discussion taking place previously on this forum or possibly on befora were it was suggested that these 1970 issued reverse wreckers left the factory unassembled and were thereafter shipped to the USA where they were reassambled and the axles crimped using professional crimping machinery (possibly courtesy of Fred Bonner??, Was Bonner in on it???)

So if Mike Stannard did research this variation with any conviction;

Where did he get the information that the models were produced/assembled in the Factory?

If these 1970 reverse wreckers were sold to collectors as authentic, who did the selling and where did this happen?

If they were sold as "Authentic", why did collectors at the time not question why these models had thick booms and BP labels instead of decals and immediatly discount them as worthless fakes??

motorman wrote:Mike Stannard states in his guide that the early issue reverse wreckers all had the thin boom and goes on to state

"These earlier castings of the model with green cabs are thought to have been trial runs"

Now that statement tells me that if these were colour trials then they must have been produced with the approval of Lesney management at least to trial stage.

I assume that this particular variation would have been of great interest to Mike Stannard and that he would have gone out of his way to get as much information on its origins as he could for his guide. With that in mind i will also assume that he spoke to a few knowledgable collectors or possibly ex lesney employees at the time of his conducting his research and that would have been were this information about them being trials came from.

He also states

"In 1970 models with green cabs were produced, unknown to Lesney, in their factory and sold to collectors as authentic"

This has confused me as (unless i am mistaken) i have a recollection of a discussion taking place previously on this forum or possibly on befora were it was suggested that these 1970 issued reverse wreckers left the factory unassembled and were thereafter shipped to the USA where they were reassambled and the axles crimped using professional crimping machinery (possibly courtesy of Fred Bonner??, Was Bonner in on it???)

So if Mike Stannard did research this variation with any conviction;

Where did he get the information that the models were produced/assembled in the Factory?

If these 1970 reverse wreckers were sold to collectors as authentic, who did the selling and where did this happen?

If they were sold as "Authentic", why did collectors at the time not question why these models had thick booms and BP labels instead of decals and immediatly discount them as worthless fakes??

Stannard got it wrong!
Here is your answer - the 1970 crimped issue were factory made to order of Joe Stone for the NAMC - same US club and same way of placing the orders that bought Arals direct from Lesney in London and had the special coloured versions of the SF#32 tanker made
http://vintagebritishdiecasts.co.uk/for ... ker#p23175

All,
Thanks for the great information on this very difficult model to find!!
Since I worked for BP, it would be awesome to add this model to my collection (even a "beater"), but it is like finding a needle in a haystack. Oh well, the quest continues.................... So many models, so little time................

Thanks,
Bill

Mick thanks for the link, I had forgotten that there had been some discussions last year on the later issue of reverse wrecker.