One of my holy grails, Magirus crane

[kwakers]

Very nice and rare model you have here godsey 1. Doing nothing to this 'Rarity' and it's axles protects it's value in my opinion. Think about antique coins or guns losing value when they are 'cleaned up' even just a little, and I see the same possibility on our Lesneys. Axle rust on an original Lesney has never bothered me or lowered the value I put on it. Patina screams originality, 'Clean' brings closer inspection and suspicion when I see it. Axles that are cleaned and 'shined' has kept me from buying a few rare wheel variations I have seen for sale by well-known Toy dealers. I understand that an eraser or WD 40 can be used carefully, but if the finished product has diminished patina in ANY way, you may then regret not having taken Nick's advice just to leave ANY Super Rare toy alone. I am in full agreement, and I felt compelled to repeat my own feelings here that strongly echo his....... Once a model is taken out of a damp and wet cellar, axle rust stops. In a heated house, rusty axles have no negative atmospheric exposure, and will stay unchanged for decades without any treatment at all unless you live by the ocean........... kwakers

[nickjones]

.....and while technically it is not oil, GHOSTHUNTER.

It's actually fish oil believe it or not!

[numi]

The word "patina" as i understand means natural tarnish or natural discoloration.It occurs mainly on metals due to its composition & exposure (others could elaborate) and sometimes on different types of glass.We should not confuse ourselves with old handling-stains,oils & dust layers(grime)against rust & rots on bare metals.I used this term "patina" as "follow-up" to others having used it inappropriately but i was wrong to have continued in the first place and for this i say that im sorry.
Rust is no patina but just that.Metal rust is not a naturally occurring phenomenon but a composition & environmental one yet some could oppose this.Also dirt,dust,nicotine & grime on our Lesney castings is no patina and should/could be carefully cleaned away/removed if one knows how to do it with no rocket science required and without dilemma too.One would never see a highly collectible 1960's Ferrari Dino appearing in a classic car show with its "original patina".It just doesn't happen.Why?...because its a rare investment collectible and had to be taken care of and protected from/against the harsh environmental effects,accidents,rust & rot.

Why do people damp-seal their house walls,Corrosolve their cars(spraying Tectyl),fill engine anti-freeze,grease the wheel-bearings,pulleys,joints & ball-joints,door jams & hinges,apply copper-slip on bolt threads,why do they oil-treat & varnish bare furniture or most types of exposed wood,etc,etc,.Do we call this tampering and going against OE Mnfg specs? Answer is a simple NO but mostly a preventative measure for protection & longevity which inadvertently is your investment protection.
Would one knowingly live near a chemical plant or leave his car parked nearby whether prized or other for a long period of time? Why will the the answer be a definite NO? There are constant vapours (salts or chemical) in every home whether living on the coast or inland.Even temperature controlled rooms are exposed to vapours.

Dad & I are both coin collectors and we know how to "clean" and conserve coins & remedy certain defects without any tampering and without any other experts noticing or condemning any.Almost anything can be cleaned or given new life if one attempts and knows HOW NEVER TO RUIN IT.Generally some people say they cannot do things or that it cannot be done but to me they are just purely not interested in any attempts or plain lazy or cannot apply basic common sense which is not so common after all.

@ Kwakers,Applying a simple oil treatment does not in any way mean tampering with any mechanical or structural elements and cannot see how its value would be "threatened" esp if the process can be immediately reversed if desired.No chemicals,rubbing,sanding,alterations etc is taking place here.
Hypothetically,do any of our shiny-mint models whether ultra-rare or common require patina to authenticate its origin.Are u saying that all clean models with factory-clean axles would be treated or scrutinized as though they were fakes? Is their value gonna be affected by this? Should we purposefully neglect it so as to welcome rust & rot "patina" or should we have to take the common-sense exacting approach of care? Rust is welcome nowhere as far as im concerned.

Rusting & eventual rot is in layman terms is caused in this sequence ie:tarnish,oxidation,rust dust,corrosion,decomposition/degradation/crusting,eventual rot and demise.I had seen rot on axles that was so bad that when Dad tried turning the wheel it simply broke off in his hand and that was the end of one of the rare castings that we all would have wanted in our displays.Wait for it......a #50 John Deere Tractor with the #39 Ford Tractor rear wheels.That YPH actually bonded to the axle-end which rotted away causing this loss not only financial but loss of Matchbox history for the future generation of collectors.Bad things (detriments) happen out of intentional neglect.
For what its worth and as i mentioned earlier that Kurt or anybody on here really doesn't have to use this remedy that i mentioned although taking early preventative measures is better than the cure and blatant losses.
I certainly would not argue that we are all different in the ways we think and do things.
Hope i didn't bore u all....
numi

[kwakers]

I believe Mick pointed out the oxidation on the hook pin of this Crane was a good indicator of this model's age and originality Numi. I looked at the natural oxidation on the single axle pictured, and thought that also was a very positive attribute of this particular Rare example. This oxidation is very attractive to me, but may not suit you. I have seen this same light axle oxidation for 50 years now on models we found on cellar railways, even on our own!
The 'Oiling' you suggest is used on 100+ year old Motorcycles and Autos to protect what is left of their original factory paint from rust and to satisfy enthusiasts like myself who preserve original features that might be considered worn out and shoddy to others. That originality is also what I enjoy in my 'Rare' Toys, a 'Loved' former life' that may not have kept them all that well cared for.
You and Dad are professional in what you do in protecting your Toys Numi. A Rare Crane like this Toy is not for any collector to start cleaning up without having the years of experience to do so properly as you do. Your advice is Great for common Lesneys, but here is an example of a simple act done on a tough wheel color variation I held in my hand:
I now have a very used Silver Plastic wheel 58 A BEA Coach out of England in our collection. I passed up a "PERFECT" (Yes Numi, your "Mint Perfect", not just my NearlyMint" one at a show last year, not because of the axle ends, they were also perfect. I passed up this Mint model because the axles were SO bright and shiny, they had only recently been cleaned and polished by someone. That made this tough to find 50 year old model unacceptable to me because the axles had no oxidation or patina at all. I liked the price and the model's mint paint and decals, but hated those 'cleaned' axles. Someone else is proud to now have that Bus in their collection, but it was not for me........kwakers

[Tinman]

No rubbing involved but apply a drop of WD-40 or similar into the wheel holes & axles-endings (where the wheels turn) using a toothpick and turn the wheels a couple of times (or clock & anti-clock wise movements) so that the rust (dirty oil) sort of squeezes/washes out.Wipe off and repeat maybe once,twice until the residue shows clear.It will then be protected and would disallow continual untreated metal-rusting and plastic-bonding over time and which causes wheels to fall off due to this rot.Many a rare model perished this way.Thereafter wipe off all excess oil on the wheels and axles.U could even apply this WD-40 or similar on the whole axle and wipe off any excess.This way u would not be removing the rust.If the wheel seems tight then do not force any but apply oil and leave overnight and that helps.Dad is a pro at this!
numi

I think it's important to know what you're putting on your models when you use these type of products.

WD40 isn't an oil at all in the conventional sense. It's main (and designed) use is for water displacement. Due to it's very light viscosity it can also act as a penetrating lubricant. After it is applied, the majority of the light solvents evaporate quickly leaving behind a tiny amount of very light viscosity lubricant (which also evaporates in due time).

The main ingredient in WD40 is Mineral spirits (a Stoddard lubricant, sometimes called white spirits and is just below Naphtha). This makes up nearly 90 percent of the contents. The remaining content is a tiny amount of mineral oil (a very light viscosity lubricant) and perfume (the perfume is butyl alcohol based). The perfume is to hide the kerosene like smell of the low grade mineral spirits. Formulas slightly differ from country to country due to laws in place within each country (this can cause the vehicle to be anything from low grade higher sulfer mineral spirits to something going higher up the tower towards Naphtha).

Their web site states that the main ingredient is not a Stoddard lubricant, but it truly is just that. The reason for this is that their formula is a trade secret. The product was never patented by it's original maker; the Rocket Chemical Company. The reason for this is that the inventor did not want to have to disclose the "secret" formula. I've read many accounts of how WD40 came to be including many who claimed it was developed as a water displacement spray for use in WWII. It was developed after WWII and specifically for use as a water displacement on Atlas rockets (the USA's early ICBMs).

[godsey1]

The only history I can get from the seller is that his father in law got it in New Hampshire a long time ago, the same as the other Matchbo'sx that they are selling.

Tony

[numi]

The only history I can get from the seller is that his father in law got it in New Hampshire a long time ago, the same as the other Matchbo'sx that they are selling.

Tony

For sure this Tan truck is genuine but for the rest of his rares that he sells certainly doesnt come from his FIL.This guys a confidence trickster & thief so any smooth BS will come out of his mouth. (sorry Guys)
numi

[numi]

Thanks Tinman for the informative write-up,most appreciated.
Heres my specimen that was coated with WD-40 3yrs ago to the date.I checked it just now and the oils are still present.
numi

[godsey1]

numi, can we see more pictures of your crane? I like this color better than the silver painted.

Tony

[godsey1]

The crane has been listed on E-Bay, the display will be put up on there in the next day or 2 if no interest here. Thanks again,

Tony